If you saw someone walking down the street and you knew that they would run into a mugger if they went two blocks further, wouldn’t you try to warn them? And on that same note, if you just got out of a relationship with a narcissist, wouldn’t you be sort of obligated to warn his or her new source of narcissistic supply about what they were getting themselves into?
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I am sure most of us have had the same thought when the narcissist in our lives found their new supply.
Doesn’t someone need to tell them what they are getting into before they get into it?
But in most cases, we don’t bother – because we know it’ll do no good. Triangulation and the narcissist’s ability to make things our fault usually stops us.
Since I have a platform, I decided that putting it on my website would be a way for me to say what I wanted to say and if she ever finds it she will know why I did it the way I did. So now, at least my conscience is clear: she can read it if she wants to know.
Want a look into how I decided to handle the need to let her know? You can check out my letter to her here: To the new supply of my narcissistic nightmare. (Fair warning: See what Angie says about trying to warn the new supply before you try it.)
Come over to Divorce Your Narcissist and join in on the discussion.
After my husband was served, but before he went into default, we both received an Order to Attend a Parenting Class. The order said that we were to both attend the parenting class in person. My difficulty was that I have such severe anxiety that I couldn’t go to stores by myself – much less a room full of others in my same position (but who could probably envision this actually working in their own situation).
And why do I have to take a class when he isn’t even doing his part?
I took my chances and looked up an approved online parenting class on the list given to me by the courthouse.
While I was taking the class, I was trying to imagine what it would be like in those situations with my covert narcissist. After watching the videos and taking the tests, I realized that while I knew the answers, I did not foresee any of that working out in my life.
After the test was taken, I had my first case management hearing where I was informed that I needed the judge’s permission before I could file it. So I went downstairs and filed a Motion to Have Online Parenting Class Accepted. I chose to ask for forgiveness instead of permission and it worked out for me.
Looking on the clerk’s website and seeing that the judge approved it took a huge weight off my chest. I was well on my way to a DIY divorce. Finally!
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Here it is on Sunday night, and I’m a little resentful because there was a way to prevent this much work in a divorce. Let’s not forget that while I am playing my own attorney, I am also raising my kids, volunteering at their school, writing my blog, and I have a third shift job.
I am supporting my children (who I had with my narcissist) fully on my own. Plus, I am also helping my daughter, granddaughter, and grandson – who is only a week old.
If he had even an ounce of empathy, he would do his part. He would provide what I have asked for without such a fight and knowing how he destroyed my life over the 13 years I’ve known him with his constant drug use – well, you would think he would want to do the right thing. He just thinks I deserve it. I gave him plenty of time to act like a human.
Okay, lesson learned.
A step I did not do while filing for divorce is the discovery phase.* Since he was not involved and did not give his information I did not think to subpoena his information and the general magistrate did not say I should. I even have an attorney that I have worked with through all of this and she never said I should do one. I suggest filing a subpoena for production of documents from a non-party whether you think your spouse will cooperate or not. This is not in your divorce packet.
*Editor’s Note: Discovery, in the law of common law jurisdictions, is a pre-trial procedure in a lawsuit in which each party, through the law of civil procedure, can obtain evidence from the other party or parties by means of discovery devices such as a request for answers to interrogatories, request for production of documents, request for admissions and depositions. Discovery can be obtained from non-parties using subpoenas. When a discovery request is objected to, the requesting party may seek the assistance of the court by filing a motion to compel discovery.
I really counted on him to do the right thing. I asked him to send me his check stubs every payday. Had he done that, I would have been able to show the judge and my divorce would be over because I would not have worried so much about the past marital debt in my name. I would have had the child support set and the judge would have determined spousal support and I would be well on my way to healing. We would have no more dealings and no reason to talk. We still have no reason to talk but it is keeping him in my head.
The lesson here? The discovery phase should be done after filing. Do not count on your narcissist to do the right thing.
Tomorrow, I will be going to the courthouse and filing my first subpoena. Luckily our courthouse has an area that you can print the forms for a small fee. I will be at the courthouse when they open at 8:30 am and then have to print, fill them out, and file them by 9:10 am to get home and take the kids to school. With legal proceedings, there is a time limit and it is important to get everything done on time.
Stay tuned for part 2 of the subpoena.
Enjoying this series? If so, you might also like our sister site, Divorce Your Narcissist.
When you go to the case management hearing, mine was handled by the general magistrate, they will go over the list of papers you need to have. Bring in the copies of all of your papers that you have on hand from filing the dissolution of marriage and any mail you have received from the courthouse along the way. The checklist will help you get everything in order for your final hearing.
After you make sure that all paperwork is in order and you have copies of all financial records such as the debt owed in your name, the income of both parties, assets, and life insurance policies make copies and add it – because you will need it for the final hearing.
When you have everything in order you will call the judge’s assistant and set a date for the final hearing. They will usually give you a few and you pick the one that best fits you. If your spouse has an attorney they will try to set the date but remember you are an acting attorney so if the dates they choose don’t fit yours, don’t be afraid to tell them so.
Lessons I have learned through making mistakes. During my case management hearings, we never went over the financial obligations. Knowing what I know now if there are bills from the marriage that are in your name that you want your spouse to help pay, you need to provide copies to the court. If the bills are in your spouse’s name it is their responsibility to provide copies to the court. My largest bill that I am not willing to take on all on my own is in my name and is affecting my credit but with no support at this time I can only afford the main bills and I am not willing to take this marital debt on myself.
Unfortunately, I did not learn that lesson until the final hearing that turned out not to be the final. I will be contacting my credit card company to get a printout of my statement from January 2017 until we separated in November. The court can require him to supply money to pay for this. Something that you also need to be aware of is even though the court can order your spouse to pay past bills, child support, and spousal support it does not mean that they will but it will be on record and if your spouse ever comes into money on the books, you will get paid.
Getting records with no spouse involvement.
A subpoena duces tecum is a subpoena for production of evidence. I received indigent status, so I will be filing this next week to have his employers provide his income to me. In all of the stress of filing it on my own and dealing with the DVI at the same time, it is amazing how much I have forgotten legally.
I wish I had thought to subpoena them before the hearing. I hoped because he was in default this would not be necessary but since it seems to be one of the factors holding me back from spousal support I will go that route.
My husband worked for cash for many years because he could not hold a real job and hide money for his drug use – but he was supposed to be paying support on 3 of his older children. Over the 10 years we were married, he mostly worked landscaping for cash jobs and his child support built up. The government took our taxes every year and gave it to his exes. I am thankful this year will be different.
In the next part of my series, we will be discussing the parenting class.
What I thought was going to be an in and out and I get my way hearing had a few more steps. All of the months that my husband and I were still somewhat communicating, I tried on more than one occasion to get his check stubs and of course, he wasn’t compliant except once. Not enough for what I was looking for in the divorce.
A learning experience in the books for subpoena power.
On the plus side, I know the two places my husband is working for and filing the paperwork will be free. Due to already having indigent status with the courts, all I have to do is send them to his employers. I should have taken care of this step sometime in July to have it ready for the final hearing.
Hindsight tells me this would’ve been a lot quicker had I taken care of these steps earlier but there was no one reminding me of the steps.
So save yourself some trouble! If you don’t have check stubs, have tax returns, or anything to prove the amount your spouse gets paid, think ahead and file a nonparty subpoena* to produce records also called Subpoena duces tecum. Since he is in default he hasn’t produced anything and I should have thought better than to trust him.
*Editor’s Note: According to Cornell University Law, “under rare circumstances, a nonparty witness might have a ground for seeking a protective order under Rule 26(c) with regard to the manner of recording or the use of the deposition if recorded in a certain manner. Should such a witness not learn of the manner of recording until the deposition begins, undesirable delay or complication might result. Advance notice of the recording method affords an opportunity to raise such protective issues.” It is defined by the dictionary as “a writ ordering a person to attend a court and bring relevant documents.”
While in court, the general magistrate said some things to me that had me going back through statute on spousal support and since the law is the law I have to prove what laws I deserve the spousal support under. I have the law and now I need the proof that he can afford it. He will never be someone I can count on as he has never been in the last 12 years and continues to not be now. I will be working on that next week and I will write about that in this series. Think about the empowerment when this is all over with.
Enjoying this series? You might also be interested in our sister site, Divorce Your Narcissist.
When you make the decision to file for divorce on your own, you will realize quickly that there are a lot of things that have to be done. Once the court has the paperwork, your next step is to get your spouse served. Some states have process servers and some states just have law enforcement serve them. But the good news is that it is not something you will have to do. I worked with a process server and my husband was served within hours of me filing the paperwork because I knew that he was leaving the state and things would be a lot harder as well as expensive with him so far away.
He did call me after he was served and assured me I would get my answer. Of course, I am still waiting. There is a time limit for your spouse to answer the petition and it is usually 20 days or less, but if they miss that deadline, then your case will go into default and you will more than likely get what you’ve asked for. It does take a little longer to do it all on your own and without the other party participating but the savings and lack of contact make it worth it.
There will be a case management hearing; I had two, so that the court can make sure that you have all of your paperwork in its entirety and that you have done everything you needed to do. If your spouse is involved in the divorce they will be there also.
If you can both agree on the terms of the divorce, it goes a little quicker. But if not, just do your best to relax and know that it will come to an end sooner than later.For example, I filed for divorce January 10 and my final hearing was supposed to be August 24th (this didn’t go as planned, so the new final hearing October 8, 2018). It has been a long wait but I can finally see the light at the end of the tunnel.
We were both court-ordered to take a parenting class in order for the divorce to go through. Some states make it mandatory and some don’t. Most states want you to take the class in person but if there is some reason you can not attend an in-person class you can file a motion with the courthouse and ask the judge to approve you taking the online class but you will have to have a reason other than you do not want to. Because of my anxiety and C-PTSD, being in a room full of strangers while I was still stuck with the verbal and mental abuse was not an option. I actually took the class first and asked for permission later. Luckily my judge was understanding and it was accepted.
We have covered how to start the process of the divorce and also having your spouse served.
Now to start the waiting game. There will be a lot of that. My county has a web page for the clerk’s office that you can look at to see the activity on your case. Every page you filed is on there and you can keep an eye on it to see if your spouse has done their part.
Divorce is stressful any way you go about it. Know that you are a survivor and this is just another bump in the road. You have overcome so much more. Good luck SPANily! I look forward to hearing about your experiences along the way. You never know who your experience can help.
Check out our new sister site, Divorce Your Narcissist for more resources and information on divorcing your narcissist.